tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21258644.post8922120750276053696..comments2024-03-27T15:45:49.926+04:00Comments on Life in Dubai: Telling it (not) like it isSeabeehttp://www.blogger.com/profile/06939892206726271433noreply@blogger.comBlogger20125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21258644.post-27224583570363020352010-03-30T01:17:37.848+04:002010-03-30T01:17:37.848+04:00Hey Seabee. This is Isaac. What a what. Odd that y...Hey Seabee. This is Isaac. What a what. Odd that you told me about this post a full half year after it was made. My comments back on this tirade can be found here:<br /><br />http://submedia.tv/stimulator/2009/05/31/the-real-cost-of-slave-labour/#commentsthewanderingsufihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06848754858420993378noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21258644.post-50854005458702789012009-06-27T21:35:23.424+04:002009-06-27T21:35:23.424+04:00Anon@7.31, I agree, holding passports happens all ...<b>Anon@7.31</b>, I agree, holding passports happens all too often. <br /><br />The government has a campaign of sorts to inform employees of their rights, where and how to complain, a hotline has been set up - there are leaflets in various languages for example - but much more needs to be done.Seabeehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06939892206726271433noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21258644.post-1537050682632353222009-06-27T19:31:30.673+04:002009-06-27T19:31:30.673+04:00Seabee,
I stumbled upon your blog, and have been...Seabee, <br /><br />I stumbled upon your blog, and have been reading with great intrest, and I see my point of view reflected in a lot of your posts.<br /><br />A though on your comment about it being illegal for employers to hold on to passports: that may be the law, but a lot of companies in Dubai still hold on to employees' passports. This happens in the local mom-and-pop establishments, as well as in multi-national companies located in free zones. <br /><br />The laborer rarely knows his rights, and does not have the better job/house/car back home to stand up against injustice, and just hands over his passport without a whimper, when told that this is company policy. This laborer does not know that the company cannot hold on to his passport, and does not know where to get his voice heard, if he does find out.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21258644.post-24715044607862183142009-06-10T08:23:40.806+04:002009-06-10T08:23:40.806+04:00Oh, one more thing. For people who have been here ...Oh, one more thing. For people who have been here for long, and have children in school, the contant "threat of deportation" may not be relevant, but the constant "threat of having to leave in short notice" is always there. <br /><br />There are few places in the world, where someone can live in a country for 20 years as a white collar worker, but yet may have to leave in a period of 1 month if he doesnt get an an apartment. This happenned in AUH where rents were much crazier than DXB in 2007-2008<br /><br />People who were renting an apt at 80k suddenly had to move out (building to be "renovated"), and found nothing in the market under 150k. That is akin to being under a constant fear of having to leave all of a sudden.....Mohammednoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21258644.post-2149325221951318502009-06-10T08:18:42.494+04:002009-06-10T08:18:42.494+04:00Very well put ZeTallGerman and Rosh.
Seabee, the...Very well put ZeTallGerman and Rosh. <br /><br />Seabee, the threat of deportations isnt strong amour "your" circle of expats. To be honest, it isnt even strong in my circle, but that doesnt mean we can extrapolate it to the entire expat population. <br /><br />Rosh was to the point, and there are plenty of such cases. We both mentioned the 90's if you noticed, which is when regulations were even less stringently enforced and whimsical people with influence had more power to put who they ant in jail. <br /><br />And BTW there is a BIG difference between unscrupulous employers taking advantage of employees (happens even in most 1st world countries), and a situation where even the wrong person hitting your car will lead to you going to jail. <br />Here, there is a very fine line between being in jail and being deported.Mohammednoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21258644.post-27093357847593172502009-06-07T14:44:33.300+04:002009-06-07T14:44:33.300+04:00ZTG the 'slave labour' and deportation thi...<b>ZTG</b> the 'slave labour' and deportation things are separate from the citizenship issue - but I agree with you absolutely. It's unrealistic to tell us to integrate when we can only live here on three-yearly renewed visas.<br /><br />In contrast, the Aussie way is to limit immigration, but those who are allowed in are encouraged to become citizens. Big publicity campaigns are run by the government to try to get immigrants to become Australians.<br /><br />The belief is obviously that people will integrate more readily and easily if they are citizens, carrying an Aussie passport.Seabeehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06939892206726271433noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21258644.post-26583410179526898402009-06-07T13:36:40.354+04:002009-06-07T13:36:40.354+04:00As to what rosh said:
That is still one of the maj...As to what rosh said:<br />That is still one of the major issues for which the UAE deserves to be critisized for: my fiance was born here, studied here, made his driving license here, and has always worked here, never abroad. Yet, despite having been here for the entire 31 years of his life, he has NO MORE RIGHTS than an expat who gets off a plane at Dubai airport this morning.<br />Threat of deportation? This may be a dramatic way of putting it, but it's reality. I've had friends put in Al Slammer and deported for seemingly innocent and unimportant "crimes" such as a small bar fight... or kissing in public... or even trying to give first aid to an injured cyclist who had been knocked-off his bike.<br />No matter how long we are here, we will never made to feel like "home" by the government or Emirati citizens. And because of that, a recent call for "expats to integrate more into UAE culture" will remain unanswered by most of us... why integrate, for what benefit?<br /><br />BTW: exit from UAE is being planned... not because we're forced, but because after 12 and 31 years respectfully starting to loose faith in humanity here.ZeTallGermannoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21258644.post-39259947240055936852009-06-06T11:48:14.189+04:002009-06-06T11:48:14.189+04:00Rosh I wasn't ignoring people in your position...<b>Rosh</b> I wasn't ignoring people in your position - I have many friends and aquaintances who were born here or came as children when their parents moved here.<br />My comment is in the context of the charge of 'slave labour' which you and the others don't fit into. You're not a slave are you?<br /><br />Like your brother & friends, my aquaintances have either continued their life here or moved on to new challenges.<br /><br />I'm not oblivious to the threat of possible deportation - over the years I know people it's happened to and others who left suddenly because they thought it might happen.<br /><br />But it isn't something that concerns the majority of expats I talk to, not something that's even in their mind. That was my point, it's not an overbearing concern amongst the expat popultaion in general.<br /><br /><b>Anon@7.29</b>:<br /><br /><i>"slave labour: i dont think there is much of any issue calling it that, considering that you have your passport and ticket confiscated by your slave trader"</i><br />It's illegal to hold employees' passports, and even though some companies do it that does not apply to the vast majority of companies and employees.<br /><br />Your comments on "deportation" have nothing to do with deportation. You're talking about laws relating to who can become resident in the country. Every country has similar laws on the subject.<br /><br /><i>Cars data</i> is not government PR but a combination of of data made public by government, banks, car dealers etc.<br /><br />Reduced advertising - yes, we're in a world-wide recession and every country is experiencing a reduction in advertising. It's also being caused to traditional media by online and other new advertising avenues.Seabeehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06939892206726271433noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21258644.post-20748591624036427292009-06-05T19:29:01.383+04:002009-06-05T19:29:01.383+04:00different people write from their life perspective...different people write from their life perspectives, and obviously you do not have enough knowledge about his experience or background. granted he might have exaggerated, but i did not see too many people leading the crusade whenever a blatant lie is spun by the official dubai PR, or published by the govt controlled media.<br /><br />slave labour: i dont think there is much of any issue calling it that, considering that you have your passport and ticket confiscated by your slave trader, and your rights to protest are either not known to these poor people, and if you strike, you could go to jail. do not tell me you did not see all those protests we saw last year, with arrests and people getting deported because they were not being paid for months, food not being provided etc. while it is not govt policy, very few countries which such miniscule populations will allow their labour rules to be so blatantly ignored.<br /><br />deportation: every month i guess there is a new rule on who can bring in their parents, what salary is needed, what kind of accommodation can be shared by how many people, what kind of relation they need to share etc. does this not sound threatening to someone who is not that rich, has old parents sharing accommodation.<br /><br />cars left behind : I am surprised you have previously questioned all data given out by dubai govt PR, but loves the questionable data given out by them on cars being left behind. <br /><br />empty advertising spaces: it is well documented local advertising has gone down close to 50% last quarter, to quote some researches.<br /><br />obviously all these may not address the points you addressed of loose writing, but what is loose to you may not be as loose to someone else. or someone else has decided loose government pr writing needs to be met with loose blog writing. whose mistakes should you be correcting...some individual's, or the governments?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21258644.post-85785498749727834882009-06-05T19:10:51.362+04:002009-06-05T19:10:51.362+04:00really good blog, keep going !really good blog, keep going !Mademoiselle Glamoratihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11664375788759614214noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21258644.post-83017455126718024452009-06-05T19:03:49.671+04:002009-06-05T19:03:49.671+04:00rosh has left a new comment on the post "Tell...rosh has left a new comment on the post "Telling it (not) like it is": <br /><br />"We all came voluntarily and we're paid for our work, so where does 'slave labour' come into it?"<br /><br />Seabee, not all amongst 'us' came voluntarily. Thousands like I are born in the UAE. We, unlike our parents (or you) didn't have that choice. It's unnerving for many like I, who've lived in one place since birth (the ONE place we've known as 'home' in every way possible) slotted into an 'expat bucket'. Well educated, travelled and brilliant individuals like my brothers & friends could relocate and live in most places on this planet. They are not in the UAE for whatever few tax free fulooss. They choose to be there, 'cause it's their home. The Media and government can call it 'transient' or whatever, but in the larger scheme of things, it's nothing farther from the truth for many like us.<br /><br />"My parents, nearing retirement age, are planning to move to India where they have rights and a far more relaxed life free of the constant threat of deportation."<br /><br />Dad moved to the UAE Oct of '69 (it wasn't even UAE back then). Trust me he didn't move for the cash or ways of life back then, he was doing really well in Ontario. Mom moved to the UAE in Sept of '74. My sister in law's granddad served in the UAE army from 1964 to 1986. Since the 1980's all three, have had that 'concern' on 'deportation' given frivolous 'causes' - i.e. for the silliest and for the blatant untruths people could be deported. Deportation was used as a 'threat' - openly or otherwise if two parties failed to reach consensus. The 'option' to have someone 'removed' played well for those lacking in ethics or humanity. This issue grew more so subsequently in the 90's (which is why I think the whole sponsorship program should be shoved back to the stone ages) For instance, someone could have an asinine boss, or have the misfortune of an unethical local business partner (because amongst the good, there's also the bad in every society) I can list a few factual events where hardworking and successful entrepreneurs, who've been in the UAE 4 decades plus, in SHJ's prison (in the golden years of their lives) given greed of local business partners. Two of them are in their late 60's, of Palestinian descent and self made successful businessmen arrived in the UAE with nothing but the clothes on their back. These people could have caved into the threat of deportation, and one of them did given in. I could go on, however, the 'threat of deportation' is a larger issue, which you seem oblivious to.<br /><br />I agree with most else you've said.roshhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03271894997251528158noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21258644.post-40637956935054888872009-06-05T18:41:53.908+04:002009-06-05T18:41:53.908+04:00This comment has been removed by the author.roshhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03271894997251528158noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21258644.post-67747505560139020282009-06-05T15:01:04.857+04:002009-06-05T15:01:04.857+04:00Anon@12.11 you couldn't be more wrong. Not sur...<b>Anon@12.11</b> you couldn't be more wrong. Not surprising really, it's the attitude I keep complaining about, people speaking authoritatively from a position of absolutely no knowledge of the subject.<br /><br />It's arrogance in the extreme, the arrogance of ignorance which I've posted about in the past.<br /><br />You know nothing about me but you feel qualified to state: <i>"Suddenly realised that this is the good life and panicked at the thought of things really becoming bad enough to send you back to a life of drudgery (and taxes) at Ozland eh!"</i><br /><br />Not that it's any of your business, but your ignorance of the facts needs to be pointed out, I have a life far from drudgery in Oz with a higher standard of living, better house, better car than in Dubai.<br /><br />That's not why I'm in Dubai, nor do I have to stay one minute longer than I choose to. I'm a completely free agent.<br /><br />I complain about things, Dubai-related or otherwise, if I think they can and should be improved. I do the same in Oz, I did the same when I lived in the UK and in Singapore, I'd do the same regardless of where I was.<br /><br />Acceptance and silence when something needs improving should not be an option.<br /><br />By the way, <i>"road diversions in the Dubai Marina and similar subjects of equal earth shattering significance"</i>.<br /><br />The blog is not called 'Earth Shattering World Events' but is 'Life in Dubai' and the majority of posts are about just that. Day to day things I come across.<br /><br />Roads not cleaned, dangerous road junctions, workers on a break, good restaurants, strange happenings in RAK, new facilities, roadside landscaping, court cases, abras and dhows on the Creek and all the rest of it, it's mundane stuff but a look at life as it is right here right now.<br /><br />That's the point of it. If you're expecting major world news you're on the wrong web page, you should try somewhere like www.bbc.co.uk/worldserviceSeabeehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06939892206726271433noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21258644.post-51475334839211855602009-06-05T12:11:30.103+04:002009-06-05T12:11:30.103+04:00Seabee, the recession has revealed an altogether d...Seabee, the recession has revealed an altogether different side of you. From being the biggest nitpicker on the blogsphere, cribbing about every misplaced pebble on the roads of your beloved Marina to being Dubai's self-appointed defender in chief. Suddenly realised that this is the good life and panicked at the thought of things really becoming bad enough to send you back to a life of drudgery (and taxes) at Ozland eh ! Not unexpectedly, you've swung to the extreme, refusing to accept any substance in that which you do not instinctively consider 'right'. Next step ? - maybe you could buy a pretty miniskirt at one of the many desperate sales in town right now and found the all new Dubai cheerleading squad...with a mandate to cheer, of course, until this economic mess gets sorted out...at which point you can revert to whining about road diversions in the Dubai Marina and similar subjects of equal earth shattering significance.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21258644.post-51840864758853825092009-06-05T12:07:25.343+04:002009-06-05T12:07:25.343+04:00Mohammed you missed the point of the post, in spit...<b>Mohammed</b> you missed the point of the post, in spite of me explaining in some detail what it was <i>not</i> about.<br /><br />In any case, unscrupulous employers exist all over the world, taking advantage of and mistreating employees. It happened fifteen years ago? It happens today too but it doesn't constitute constant fear of deportation amongst expats.<br /><br /><b>Dave</b> yes indeed, but that demands individual attention rather than being buried in paragraphs of nonsense.<br /><br />I posted about it when the enquiry was announced but there's been no information since. It probably needs some prodding from international media again.Seabeehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06939892206726271433noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21258644.post-25489408314390519952009-06-05T09:43:37.438+04:002009-06-05T09:43:37.438+04:00You always post an interesting read. And it's ...You always post an interesting read. And it's refreshing to see someone shares my view on this "information". My inbox is filled with negative stories.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10047885763744867700noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21258644.post-23657209405682777842009-06-05T00:33:55.788+04:002009-06-05T00:33:55.788+04:00hence the name 'submedia'hence the name 'submedia'Emhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01267643422775549142noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21258644.post-88006756775484441402009-06-04T21:10:20.328+04:002009-06-04T21:10:20.328+04:00There is one truth in there though Seabee and that...There is one truth in there though Seabee and that is his reference to the "torture tape" has not been properly dealt with by the UAE in any way shape or form.Davehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03473866776176076777noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21258644.post-52270651292852310132009-06-04T19:00:42.961+04:002009-06-04T19:00:42.961+04:00Interesting read and a pretty valid argument for t...Interesting read and a pretty valid argument for toning down the drama!~*♥ miss pink ♥*~https://www.blogger.com/profile/05656004675725352965noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21258644.post-36880838881046906662009-06-04T18:17:21.424+04:002009-06-04T18:17:21.424+04:00Were you equally angry when hacks/people exagerrat...Were you equally angry when hacks/people exagerrated anything good in Dubai? <br /><br />While "constant threat of deportation" sounds dramatic, you are probably not aware of the situation 10-15 years ago, when many expats in some small companies really had it against them. In some cases people not paid salaries for 6 months were told that if they complained, they would be falsely accused of some crime or absconding, and therein comes the "constant threat of deportation" thingMohammednoreply@blogger.com